Old Goat

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Posts by Old Goat

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  32

  What is the story behind this picture of Rutherford at a drinking party??

  by EndofMysteries in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  i have seen this photo several times but never any back story on it.

  was this at bethel?

  was this before or after the prohibition?

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  Old Goat

  Robo, there's also the booklet Prohibition and League of Nations. I have that somewhere still, I think.
  
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  32

  What is the story behind this picture of Rutherford at a drinking party??

  by EndofMysteries in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  i have seen this photo several times but never any back story on it.

  was this at bethel?

  was this before or after the prohibition?

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  Old Goat

  Not a booze party. A beer keg would have the spout on the bottom. This has a pump on top. That's root beer. The glasses are root beer cups, typical of the late 1920s and early 30s. I remember them well. I'm nearly 90. I don't know the source of the photo. But conclusions made from it are wishful thinking.

  There's another set of photos that show Rutherford sleeping on a tavern table, also taken out of context. I haven't seen those since I was a young man. The explanation was very tame. Humans have a tendency to see what they want to see.

  Also, a sole source claim should be looked at with considerable suspicion. The former Branch Servant who made claims about Rutherford was a questionable character. He really wasn't on "our side" if we base our opposition to the Watchtower on the facts.
  
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  32

  What is the story behind this picture of Rutherford at a drinking party??

  by EndofMysteries in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  i have seen this photo several times but never any back story on it.

  was this at bethel?

  was this before or after the prohibition?

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  Old Goat

  You have to be an old goat like me to know what that is. It's a root beer dispenser, once quite common (when people made their own). Alas, this is not a booze party.
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  90

  ATT: WARNING

  by EJ257 in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  please be aware of everything that is happening around the world at this moment in time.

  this goes to anyone, ex-communicated, removed, serving, believer and non.

  at this point in my observations i have realized many religions/ideologies know there is some sort "end of time" or a transition into a new order of living in this earth.

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  Old Goat

  The Prince of the Power of Hot Air has spoken!
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  5

  This makes me sad.

  by Old Goat in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  i have followed this blog and read the blog authors' book almost since it was first started.

  http://truthhistory.blogspot.com/.

  it seems they're shutting down their project.

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  Old Goat

  I have followed this blog and read the blog authors' book almost since it was first started.

  http://truthhistory.blogspot.com/

  It seems they're shutting down their project. I think that's a real loss. Solid facts about the Watchtower's early years are scarce.
  

  
  
  
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  34

  The origin of the name and masthead illustration of The Watchtower

  by Gorbatchov in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  thanks to the great "watchtower history" blog with historical information about the pre- and early bible students years, i became today aware of the origine of the name the watchtower and the masthead illustration in front of the old magazines.. in c.t.

  russell's younger days, his mother and other relatives died and were buried on the family plot at the allegheny cemetery.. it must have been a defining moment voor the young ctr.

  look at his inspiration to choose the name and masthead of his magazine.

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  Old Goat

  No one is suggesting Bible Students are making up stories. I'm suggesting you don't understand what you read. Bible students sell their stuff. Are they writing for profit?

  I bought a set of books from the Chicago Bible Students paying about 220 US dollars for them. That's not publishing for profit?
  

  I'm not trying to impress you. I don't need your adulation, and I'm not seeking it. But I do expect that you back up your 'stories' with some facts. You are unwilling and unable to do that.

  example: "because there’s and old goat that suggest they’ve been lying for 15 years." Translation into English: "Because there's an Old Goat who suggests they've lied." Who mentioned 15 years? You don't understand what you read.

  Bible Student histories with few exceptions are elaborations of an article Russell first wrote in 1890 entitled Perils Among False Brethren. They add gossip and some facts to what's in that article. That does not produce a rational, factual history.
  
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  34

  The origin of the name and masthead illustration of The Watchtower

  by Gorbatchov in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  thanks to the great "watchtower history" blog with historical information about the pre- and early bible students years, i became today aware of the origine of the name the watchtower and the masthead illustration in front of the old magazines.. in c.t.

  russell's younger days, his mother and other relatives died and were buried on the family plot at the allegheny cemetery.. it must have been a defining moment voor the young ctr.

  look at his inspiration to choose the name and masthead of his magazine.

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  Old Goat

  SimonS,

  I think we've already established that you know nothing about Watch Tower history. And that I do. Remember our exchange on a previous thread? You ended by saying: "My responses are not researched like yours, I don’t have time to use proper grammar, sorry."

  And you're correct. Your research is faulty. You're unwilling to correct your grammar, and I believe it hinders your understanding. There are programs for adult improvement in most school districts, and they are often free. You may want to check into one.

  You rage at Penton and Schulz and de Vienne because you don't understand the meaning of a book title. That suggests a reading comprehension or learning problem. There is no shame in that. There are remedies and ways of coping. But you turn abusive and you do so with no understanding of the subject matter.

  Some of what you say is coloured by your desire to defend Russell and Bible Students. I understand wanting to defend your faith. But even 'the true religion' is composed of human worshipers who do unaccountable things. As far as that goes, I think Schulz and de Vienne do an excellent job of being even handed. Have you read their second book? Did you read the chapter about Barbour and Russell's separation. Russell comes off well, I think.

  You do yourself and your faith no favors by ranting at others. You rant but you prove nothing because you haven't researched enough to know the details of Russellite history. Instead of suggesting someone robbed a grave, state some facts. In point of fact, though the intention was to place a small archive within the pyramid, there is no evidence that it was ever done.

  And if it was done, there was no intention of hiding secrets within the monument. The stated intention was to place some representative literature inside the monument. There would have been nothing you cannot read today. You cite some of the Bible Student convention reports, but my impression is you lifted that from a web site. You seem not to have read the original reports. Was the pyramid opened by treasure hunters. Yes. Did they find anything. Apparently not.
  

  History is built from verifiable detail. It is not built from blind faith. And it is not built from a rant based on a misunderstanding. You think Schulz suggested that Barbour was some sort of Bible Student prophet. He did no such thing. You reach that conclusion from the title of his book. What was Russell's view of Barbour after their separation? The last view was that Barbour was the evil servant, once the faithful servant but replaced by Russell. That puts him squarely in Russellite history, even if you wish it didn't.

  Take a breath. Relax. You must stop relying on web pages and secondary sources. You mentioned some books that you liked in your previous exchange with me. I could probably name them, but most books about Russell are not well done. They derive from secondary sources, and one is full of made up stories. Zydek's book is favorable to Russell, but Zydek made up long stretches of his story. Examples are an imaginary conversation between Russell and one of his uncles. A supposition presented as fact that Joseph Russell's brother paid his way to the USA. There's more, but why repeat nonsense? A contrived story is not history. History is supposed to be fact.

  If you want to understand Watch Tower history, turn to some of the original sources. Drop your reliance on silly web pages, most of which are wrong. And stop making claims you can't back up. And address the underlying problem. You have grammar and reading comprehension problems you must address. There's no sin in that. And those problems can be overcome. But, if you don't overcome them you'll continue to make one unsubstantiated claim after another, and find the response (assuming you're not just ignored.) upsetting because you wont be able to handle the issues.
  
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  34

  The origin of the name and masthead illustration of The Watchtower

  by Gorbatchov in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  thanks to the great "watchtower history" blog with historical information about the pre- and early bible students years, i became today aware of the origine of the name the watchtower and the masthead illustration in front of the old magazines.. in c.t.

  russell's younger days, his mother and other relatives died and were buried on the family plot at the allegheny cemetery.. it must have been a defining moment voor the young ctr.

  look at his inspiration to choose the name and masthead of his magazine.

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  Old Goat

  I'm not aware of insulting Island Man, Steve. If you mean how I addressed SimonSays, I suppose I'm just tired of her foolish comments and having her trail around insulting someone who's my friend. She's accused Rachael de Vienne of lying, grave robbing, and other things. But you are right. I should just ignore her.
  
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  34

  The origin of the name and masthead illustration of The Watchtower

  by Gorbatchov in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  thanks to the great "watchtower history" blog with historical information about the pre- and early bible students years, i became today aware of the origine of the name the watchtower and the masthead illustration in front of the old magazines.. in c.t.

  russell's younger days, his mother and other relatives died and were buried on the family plot at the allegheny cemetery.. it must have been a defining moment voor the young ctr.

  look at his inspiration to choose the name and masthead of his magazine.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
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  Old Goat

  Island Man,

  The idea of a Watch Tower comes from Ezekiel, There were several periodicals with some variant of the name Watch Tower. There was a British publication with a similar name in the 1830s. An American periodical associated with the millenarian movement was named Prophetic Times and Watch Tower. A small Advent Christian periodical adopted the name, though after Zion's Watch Tower was well known.
  
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  34

  The origin of the name and masthead illustration of The Watchtower

  by Gorbatchov in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  thanks to the great "watchtower history" blog with historical information about the pre- and early bible students years, i became today aware of the origine of the name the watchtower and the masthead illustration in front of the old magazines.. in c.t.

  russell's younger days, his mother and other relatives died and were buried on the family plot at the allegheny cemetery.. it must have been a defining moment voor the young ctr.

  look at his inspiration to choose the name and masthead of his magazine.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
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  Old Goat

  SimonSays,

  You continue to be a moron. There was no theft and defilement of Russell's grave. The pyramid monument is not his grave. His grave has a small headstone with his portrait engraved on it. It is nearby, but it is not the pyramid. You don't like Schulz's bio of Barbour solely because of the title which in your illiterate, mind-dead way you misunderstand. Are you suggesting that they're grave robbers? Shame on you for being stupid.
  

  Schulz and de Vienne run the truthhistory blog. http://truthhistory.blogspot.com/

  Their second book, A Separate Identity: Organizational Identity among Readers of Zion's Watch Tower, 1870-1887 (volume 1) contributes more to our understanding of the earliest years of Russell and Zion's Watch Tower than any other book.